1985 JUN 25 CC MIN - 34X65)72
MINUTES OF THE ADJOURNED REGULAR
MEETING OF THE EL SEGUNDO CITY COUNCIL
JUNE 25, 1985
CALL TO ORDER was made by Mayor Armsttrong at 7:00 P.M., Tuesday,
June 25, 1985, in the Council Chamber of E1 Segundo City Hall.
PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE was led Mayor Armstrong.
ROLL CALL was taken by City Clerk Hart:
Councilman Jacobson - present
Councilman Schuldt - present
Coucilman Siadek - present
Mayor Pro Tem Synadinos - present
Mayor Armstrong - present
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: I have been requested by the Clerk and Council to have
everyone on record as to what your complaint, or your compliment, may be. If
you are going to say something that the person just before you or five people
before you, have already said, I would accept your standing up and giving your
name and address for the matter of the record and saying that I completely
concur with the past three, or whatever. But keep it as brief as we can. Not
that we're trying to sell your complaint short, because Lord knows we're not.
We want your complaints on record and it's necessary for Group W to understand
that we are not - alot of us are not really happy with the way things are going
with the TV's in our homes.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: Mayor Armstrong, but if they have a horror story to
tell that makes a perfect example of something, I think they should feel free
to go ahead and explain their problem.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: Le, I might mention that one of the representatives from
Group W - in fact there are several representatives from Group W - here
tonight. Carol has a clipboard which has an area for your name, address, and
the nature of your complaint. I would like first off, if you circulate that,
that Council get a copy of it so we can check on how well you follow -up.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Incidentially, you might look at the board - Jack Ruis has
done a chart of the locations of the majority of the complaints - since then
there has been 35 -40 of them come in. So it's not really update to date - but
it's fairly up to date.
Council have any objection of opening the public hearing? Or,do you have any
other remarks to make first?
Public Hearing is now open. If you have something to say pertaining to
this .... Nick, do you want to do anything on this?
CITY MANAGER ROMANIELLO: I just want to make a couple of opening comments. I
want to say that Group W, in addition to the young lady, they have
representatives from every aspect of their operation here - there is about 10 -12
of them in the audience, standing outside listening or sitting in the out among
us. But the purpose of this meeting, as you all are aware, is that due to the
numerous complaints that we have been receiving for about a year and a half now,
the Council and the staff decided this would be a good method by which we can
air all of those complaints and by which we can let Group W hear for themselves
the kinds of problems we have. The map on the wall indicates the areas by which
the complaints have been received. We have indepth files we have been keeping,
we continue to keep which we can present to Group W. I have many, many letters
which are-representative of the citizens complaints. Some of them who could not
be here this evening, we have their letters which I will submit for the record
rather than try to read them all into the record. And I just want everyone to
be aware that the City is very much aware of the problems that have been
occurring for over this year and a half and we hope we will be able to
convince.
Group W that our needs are serious and that our intent is also serious and by
the conclusion of tonight's evening, if the Council and Group W is able and
willing, they will give us a few minutes - or we will allow them a few minutes
to address some of these complaints and perhaps then many of us who have
problems that can be corrected quickly will have our problems resolved.
Other than that, we have no specific agenda for you to follow, other than to
listen to the citizens as they file up to state their case.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Okay, let me bring us up to date. Mr. Clerk has the proper
notice of this hearing been given.
CITY CLERK HART: Mr. Mayor, proper notice was published on June 6, 13, and
20th.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Thank you. Files will become part of this hearing. Has any
written communication.... how many written communications have been received,
numerous?
CITY MANAGER ROMANIELLO: I think for the record, we will just keep them on
file and record them with the City Clerk's office. But rather than read them,
we will just file them.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Don't misunderstand me - I don't want them read, I just asked
if any had been received.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: Another one to add to them that was just handed to me - for
the record, Risa Pidiack.
COUNCILMAN JACOBSON: Would it be possible to get chairs set up outside. I
think we need more.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Nick, I think we're going to need about 200 chairs out
there. How many do we have? Jose? Is there enough chairs out there?
Is there anyone present who wishes to speak regarding this hearing? And if you
would, please step forward to the podium and state your name, address and I
would request that you shorten your time frame to a reasonable semblance.
DENNIS CUSHNER, 905 Hillcrest, E1 Segundo, I'm a new resident of E1 Segundo
since late March. When we first moved into the City, we got Group W cable. It
was installed well, but over the period of the next 5 -6 weeks I received six
different billings for a variety of services. And on many occasions have
called - there was no response or if there was, I got a new billing with a
different number on it. And approximately six weeks later, I finally got an
appropriate billing with the right charges. Three weeks subsequent to that,
someone had called and asked me if everything was okay and I read them the riot
act over the phone; since I had called many times during the day and evening
trying to get through and could not. The quality of service on our cable in
general, without any movie stations, has been up and down. There have been
times when we haven't had any service. I'm not one of these people on the
board here. My concern is that, the wife and I moved here from the City of
West Hollywood, where we lived for 15 months, and the service there was
extremely poor and the people were not very responsive to the complaints. This
is something people should know about.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: Same cable.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: Who was your franchise over there?
DENNIS CUSHNER: Group W Cable. On a number of occasions the cable went down
for anywhere from 24 hous to 30 hours. We'd call and get a recording or get a
busy signal. I would have to call some other outlying area in Santa Monica or
some place else to try to get them to call their office to be responsive. And
I just fed up with it - and thank God we don't live in the City any longer. My
real concern is the document that was sent to me in the mail. The concern
about the extension of the contract from 1991 to the year 2001. My only
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concern is that based on the complaints and everything else I've heard in the
City, I think we'd be crazy to sign an extended contract where we'd have
virtully no leverage against Group W Cable based on their current service
level. I think what the City should consider is other alternatives to this
service, unless Group W Cable can reconcile their present situations. I think
in order to be fair, we have to expect them to improve the service level, they
must be responsive to the complaints of the customers, and above all we want to
buy a cost effective service that we can use and be satisfied with. Thank you.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Thank you Mr. Cushner. Well prepared and well done.
ELLIS JOHNSON, 706 W. Pine, E1 Segundo, I have lived here since 1972. My
complaint is that when I signed up with Group W - I'm a country music fan - and
they told me they had the Nashville network. And I've seen it over in
Hawthorne and they have the full thing. And here we have about 2 hours a day
and none on Saturday when the Grand Ole Opry itself is on - none on the weekend
at all. And if you have any problem, it goes down - the service, and you try
to call, you don't know if it's your television set or the cable, you'll get a
call saying - your call will be answered presently and so on. You wait there
for 30 minutes and you've tried the non - charge number and you've tried the
charge number and you're on there for 30 minutes being charged for it and
you're still talking to the machine and the machine talks to you and wait for
30 minutes and your time's never come up. You'll be responded to as soon as
possible. Thank you.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Thank you Ellis. Please step forward - you may form your line
along the wall or however you want to do it.
E. G. BELL, 207 Whiting, E1 Segundo, My problem with Group W began on March
24th. I hold in my hand the work order. I had a salesman for Group W appear
at my door offering a special - $5.00 installation, basic cable (their standard
fee) - and I bought it, I paid for it - cash, this is his receipt. It took
numerous phone calls and finally on April 13 they opted to install it after
first refusing to honor their agreement. And I had to point out to them on the
phone, numerous times, that according to their own paper, this is a contract.
That maleficense - I going to address to the court system if they didn't
perform. The money that I paid indicated on a receipt, acknowledged on a work
order after three bills, I had been unable to get credit for it. I had no
cable service this morning - the system was apparently down. They haven't
disconnected me yet - with any luck at all they may. Their business practices,
as far as I'm concerned, I consulted with an attorney, was a matter of
principle, not dollars. Their attention to me as a customer was somewhat
disappointing. The broadcast quality I receive is marginally at best -
sometimes it's quite good. Like I say, within the last week, it has been down
twice - no reception at all, pure snow. I have the name of the gentleman I
spoke to in May on my bill. But apparently he must not work there any longer
because nothing's been done with my bill - it's still incorrect, I still don't
have a credit. They are now pointing out with the new billing that they're
using a telephone like bill, that I am now past due and I think I will
eventually have to terminate the service because I can't seem to get the bill -
but I'm sure they can rectify a closing bill. Thank you.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: Mr. Bell,could we have a copy of your service order?
The original order that you have, could you maybe give it to the City staff so
they have a copy of that?
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: That should probably go through the City Clerk, if I'm not
mistaken.
E. G. BELL: They called me on the Monday following and said that I had to take
a movie channel to get the special pricing. And since I refused the movie
channel, they opted to make a-refund. That's when I pursued the fact that I
have a contract. They told me they're going to get on my case if I don't
perform. So I figured a contract goes two ways.
CHERYL McCORMICK, 1620 E. Maple, El Segundo, I have the same exact contract as
Mr. Bell did. Except that fortunately, yesterday mine was resolved and I
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ordered my cable service on March 23, 1985. Before it was resolved, I made
numerous phone calls to Group W. The first one was due to the first bill I
received. They have an item here called "promotion credit" where they charged
$35.00. So I called them up to ask them what this was and the man on the phone
told me it was very complicated and he really couldn't explain it but I had to
pay it. And so I told him, "no, I didn't have to pay it because I had a
contract that said I got installation for $5.00 and I had paid my money in
advance." And he was very insistent that everyone paid this and I had to pay
it. So I asked to be transferred to his supervisor and after approximatelyy 40
minutes on the telephone going over each individual bill which is partial -
partial box charge, partial movie channel charge, we got it down to,yes,they
were wrong by $35.00. So they said they would credit my bill and the next bill
came and I got a credit for $12.00. So I called back and I was put on hold,
cumulatively over this whole time, 3 hours. And I was cut off twice after
waiting about 30 minutes. In one instance, when I first ordered my cable, it
was very fuzzy. So I made an appointment to have them come back to my house to
fix it three times. Each time they came back, they said it was in the line,
it wasn't in my box. And the last time I called, the man on the phone told me
I should take my box apart and find out if that was what was wrong.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: You?
CHERYL McCORMICK: I told him that was not my job. Eventually, like I said,
yesterday I received my new bill and to their credit, I guess over a period of
three months (from March 23 to June 24) it is corrected. But I really feel
that's an expensive period of time to correct a bill.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: How's your picture?
CHERYL McCORMICK: It's fine now.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: But apparently you have some distrust of Group W.
CHERYL McCORMICK: Yes, to say the least. I have a hard time trying to get up
the motivation to call them when I have a problem now. Because I feel like I
have to set aside 45 minutes to an hour of my day to this and it doesn't really
go over very well at work.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Cheryl,did you say you live on Maple Street?
CHERYL McCORMICK: Yes.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: East, west..?
CHERYL McCORMICK: East. If you'd like copies of my bills, I've brought all of
them.
COUCILMAN SIADEK: I think what we should do is to get a transcript - video
tape and audio tape and those folks who do have documents, we may be getting
back to you and asking for those.
CITY MANAGER ROMANIELLO: If no one objects, since it would be easier for you to
do it individually, if you would Xerox your bills and send us the copies, I
would appreciate that.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: Nick, with all due respect, I don't think - I think these
folks have been put out enough and....
CITY MANAGER ROMANIELLO: We'll Xerox them and send them back if they like.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: I think that's best.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: I have a bad feeling about ever letting an original get out
of my hands, for some reason. These are not maybe that important but then
again maybe they are.
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LIZ BALMER, 771 California Steet, E1 Segundo, The only copies I have of my
bills, of course, is a $1200.00 television set that apparently wasn't even
needed. My horror story started late last fall when our television started to
do down. I had made, probably, three appointments withh Group W to come out
and check our service. They did not keep any one of those three appointments.
I have talked to Jack Siadek about this a couple of times, I've talked to their
supervisors and was assured each time the problem would be corrected and it was
not. The only thing that they did for me promptly that I asked - we had two
channels, the movie channel and Z channel. The only thing they did do was
immediately disconnect the channel when I requested it. And I still have very
poor quality service.
DOT ROCKWELL, 304C Maryland, E1 Segundo, My story starts back in February when I
called to cancel my HBO. They cancelled my whole system. I called them that
night when I got home from work and they said, we're so sorry, we'll be out
tomorrow to hook you back up. They never showed up the next day. I called and
they said, well we have so many calls and things that we can't get a technician
out until next week. So I was watching the religious station and the Mexican
station for a few days. Neither one appeals to me. Anyway, that was in
February. Then I've had bad reception from February until May 3rd, when I had a
Friday off and I thought, well I'll be home I'll have Group W come out and fix
my TV. Well, the guy comes over and like he's real thrilled to be there. And
he goes up on the roof and he's fiddling around with it and I still have ghosts.
And then he leaves. He doesn't say I'll be back, I have too drop off
something. Nothing. He's just gone. I'm outside looking around for him and
he's nowhere to be found. By this time I'm getting mad. So I just start
disconnecting the cables and box - and I thought I'd just give it back to him,
if he comes back. Well, he came back and I said well here I don't want this
anymore, you take it back with you. He didn't have any receipts to pick up the
box - so he said that I'd have to have someone come out and pick it up or I
could drive it to Santa Monica. I said fine, I'll have somebody come pick it
up. I called and they were supposed to come out that next Thursday. My
neighbor watched for them to come out, they never showed up. So I called them
and said I have your box - what do you want to do with it? The guy says, send
it back to us - C.O.D. So I go to the Post Office, paid $3 and some change -
packed it all up, and I get this bill for $221.00 for unreturned equipment. So
I write on the bill drop dead - with a little note saying I paid this, etc. etc.
I would have shined them on but they owe me $43.00. This is all back in May.
As of today, I talked to a guy - he figured out, yes they do owe me $43.00 and
they do have my equipment somewhere up there.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: You don't think that tonight's meeting had anything
to do with them saying yes, I do owe you that money. You haven't really gotten
it.
DOT ROCKWELL: I don't know. Because last night when I got this bill, I
thought cool - it's a check. I'm real happy and it's a new bill for $221.00,
so I call and then I hear on the recording, we have new hours from 7:00 A.M. to
7:00 P.M., etc. etc. we can help - and I'm on hold from 5:21 last night until
5:45. Otis - the guy's name I talked to last night, says hey, we've only got
two guys here and I can't figure out why you owe this much money, etc. etc.
And I'll have to call you back tomorrow. So he didn't call me back by 10:30
like he said so I called him about 11:00 and he checked with the supervisor and
that's when he figured out yes we owe you the money. And I haven't had Group W
since May 3rd and I get better reception without it - hooked up to the antenna
that comes through a wall in my building.
ELEANOR GRAY, 362 Virginia, E1 Segundo, I guess after listening to everyone
else, I have kind of a minor complaint. But my television has been acting up
lately and a lot of people have told me I needed a new selector box - it was
jumping off the channel - and I don't know where it came from. So I wasn't
sure if it was my television, it was like someone said, you don't know. So I
called on the 7th of June, I called and only had to wait about 10 minutes
before somebody answered. I thought that was unusual, but anyway, Michael said
yes, someone would call me and make an appointment to put in a new selector
box. So it wasn't as though as I was asking for something free, they're
charging me for it. Anyway, I said I would be either at home or at the office,
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June 25, 1985
I work part -time. So he said, oh yes, someone would call me - I gave him the
days I would be at home and that was the 7th of June. And no one has called
yet - at work or at home. And I'm sure they never will.
GLEN CHRISTENSON, 305 Loma Vista, E1 Segundo, I have two things to say in
regards to the Cable station. The first is that about year and a half ago some
close friends of mine who are an elderly couple, in their 80's, had problems
with their box. They made numerous phone calls and did not get anywhere, so I
called for them. And my point is not that I called for them, but my point is
that they were not treated well as senior citizens. And this is wrong. Now in
my case, is much less of importance, I am trying to subscribe to the station
and I was promised to have an installation on Wednesday, no one showed. And on
Saturday, no one showed. Then today after 2:00 - they came at noon and I was
still at work. We're trying again for Friday, but of course, that's it. If it
doesn't happen Friday, I won't get the cable. People were pleasant to me on
the phone, that's one good thing I'll say for them.
BONNIE FOX, 1736 Sycamore, E1 Segundo, and I've been a resident for about 7
years and I've had Group W for about two. In the beginning it was okay. When
I had a problem with it, they were out, say in two weeks, they would call me at
work and have me meet them at my house and they would install my service or
reinstall it. Now the past three months, my cable has been going frequently.
In fact it would out for a whole month and when we called them they said they
would be out within two weeks and would reimburse us the money, which is
supposed be about $20.00. They reimbursed us about $4.00. Now I haven't had
cable since April, and when we call it takes forever and ever to get a hold of
them. The same story - and the last time we called they said they'd be out
They couldn't make an appointment any earlier than two weeks - and with
working it's a little hard to run back and forth and expect them there. So we
have an appointment for next Saturday at their convenience. But I've gotten
used to installing my regular antenna and checking back and forth. And another
interesting thing happened - we had a neighbor who got very ticked off and had
them take out his unit and the man asked a neighbor if anybody else had Group
W and the neighbor said yes, so he disconnected ours. So it's just been one
thing after another, I'm really unhappy with it. And the reception with the
cable is bad. Ghosts all the time.
MARK JONES, 770 W. Imperial, 412, El Segundo, President /Homeowners Association,
a 100 unit condominum complex and besides the myriad of complaints involving,
include general poor quality reception, bad installations, billing problems, and
that - there's other problems I've noticed and are probably happenind to these
multiple family dwellings in the City - and that is when the installers come
out, they enjoy littering all over the place, the cable lines they cut off when
they do installation - they toss, they lay all over the building. Around every
terminal box you can a little nest of fittings and copper cuttings and things
like that and I know I wouldn't want to slip on one of those round cable ends.
I haven't but I'm waiting for someone to do that. To my knowledge, they don't
follow any safety practices. There are parts of our cable system that are -
the building is approximately 50' tall - we've had 10' sections of half round
come off at 50' high, they don't fix any problems that exist. And as far as I
know, once it falls down and hits someone - but they won't take any preventive
measures whatsoever. Also, we have a very large problem with marketing. We
have a security building - or should I say we have locks on our doors. Group W
will do anything - their marketing will do anything to get into the building.
They'll say, I'm Group W can you let me in and most people will let someone in.
We have a contract with Group W as far as how they are to market the building.
Not one person I've met from Group W, that is out marketing building, knows of
the contract - such as they are to make prior arrangements with us to market
the building. They do not do this. If they do not get into the building, they
leave stacks of literature in front of our building, which then blows all over
the bushes. And it's futile calling them because it does not good. I've
called them before and they go - well what name was on it. You tell them the
name that was on it and they say they'll be sure it doesn't happen again.
Well, it may not with the same person, but six months later they have somebody
else. So we get more out there.
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MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Mark, you spoke to Council about three weeks ago, you are
that little cluster up in the upper left hand corner. We're well aware of your
problems.
COUNCILMAN SCHULDT: Aren't you the gentleman who talked us about one of the
installers walking on somebody's car and they had to get it painted?
GLEN CHRISTENSON: They've walked, they've driven into the building with their
trucks. And as far as for actual service problems, there is one guy - who's
here, Gregg and he's about the only person from Group W that I've met that
actually knows anything about the cable system. And they need alot more like
him and I think he must be in charge of half of E1 Segundo because I always see
him running around here fixing all the problems of their installers.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Mark, I should have recognized this years ago when I moved
my house in on a lot and there was a cable TV to Jim Mitchell's house, which
was tearing my roof apart. I saw a Group W guy going down the street and I
stopped him, and I said hey look at this cable. And he looked at the cable and
looked at my house and said the cable was here before your house was.
JONES: In terms of popularity, they're right next to the Hyperion plant.
DICK FENNELL, 535 Maryland, E1 Segundo, And I still don't have cable. I've
trying since December of '84. The latest in an episode that's just carrying on
and on, it's getting to be a little bit much, they finally pulled the cable down
to the houses. And out in front of the house, they've torn up the street, the
sidewalk and pulled the cable down to the house, filled it up with a kind of
asphalt type material and put a steel cover over there - which has since sunk.
They pulled the cable up to my house and up to Mr. Pervis' who's at 545 and he
has a sidewalk coming around his garage. So instead of putting the cable up to
his house and up to my house, they put both the cables up to my house. They
didn't go up to his house. So he has a slight predicament. They called and
said they'd like to hook it up to the house. So we made an appointment for the
20th of June. They showed up on the 19th and we were not home. So they left a
card that said please call. So I got on the phone and called and was on hold
for 20 -25 minutes and the thing said our new service hours were from 7 -7. So I
went into the office the next morning at about a quarter to 7 and promptly at 5
minutes after 7 I called. I stayed on hold until 7:45 and I never did talk to
anybody. So I hung up and asked my secretary to try it again at 9:00 and she
was frustrated and when I came back she was on for 20 minutes and we still
haven't talked to them. So finally the man called me and said I'll call Monday
- last Monday, and make an appointment to come out and discuss the problem and
see if we can't get it hooked up. So we said fine and I wasn't home last night
and at 10:00 P.M. last night he called my wife and wanted to set up an
appointment to come out and see this cable we'll need - and needless to say,
since I wasn't there, she wasn't going to go through the whole rigomoroll. And
that's where it stands at this time. I tried to call them today and that
number, our new extended services are going to help you - boy, that's winner,
let me tell you. I've heard that phone message so often that I can recite it
verbatim.
GERRY RICHMOND, 209 E. Oak, E1 Segundo, in November, 1983, I called and ordered
they install HBO and movie channel as a Christmas gift for my mother, who is 76
years old. As Jack knows, I have a business in town and I cannot sit on the
phone all day. Number one, when they first came out to install it, they connect
up Z channel - which is what the work order said, which is not what I had
requested. I've been in E1 Segundo since '54 and I've never had problems
until the last 2 years, and I agree with the other gentlemen - the young man
right here (referring to Gregg from Group W) knows what he's doing - but he's
the only one around here that does. My complaint is with their administration -
their home office. I called them up and I got it straightened it out. So they
went out and then we got movie channel and had HBO and the billings were to be
sent to my office. I kept getting billed for 3 channels. I kept paying the
bill. Finally after six months I got fed up. I called them numerous times, we
don't have Z channel, please deduct it from the bill - credit me. One time I
got mad and I took the credit and applied it to the bill and I sent it back to
them. But when the deficit got to the point of $142.00, and my mother's calling
me in panic - they're going to disconnect our cable. I turned
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June 25, 1985
around and it took another half an hour. Don't tell me your computers are down
- this stories getting.... We've had computers for years. Finally, we got that
straightened out. The girls I talked to....I kept writing down their names...I
photocopied the bills, I photocopied my checks and I said now you owe me money
- like a couple months of service. A second time they went out, and a third
time they went out and I get another phone call - it was a very rainy day -
they're gonna disconnect it, I said disconnect. Because we will have a lawsuit
and I will own Group W Cable. I had just about had it.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: I would hope you'd do a better job.
GERRY RICHMOND: I'm sure I could. I run a business. This is the problem -
it's in their administation. I don't know what they do in these home offices.
But I know if I ran my business this way, I'd have damn few customers.
And if we didn't have such terrible response over there, we wouldn't have it
now.
COUNCIIMAN SCHULDT: I get the feeling that ..... I don't think this is done
accidentally. I think it's done on purpose, because what it does.....like this
one lady said, it discourages you from calling for problems. In other words,
for every time you've a got a little problem, you're not going to give them a
call. I remember some years ago, I wanted to cancel and the same thing. I
don't think this is something new to the service because I believe this has
been going on for many years. You can get service in anytime you want, I
should say generally, because you can get somebody on the phone, but to get
them out to pick up a box or pick up or fix something, is just impossible. I
think it's purposely done. I don't think it's no accident.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: It's definitely intimidating.
LaVONNE SORRENSON - JACKSON, 1005 E. Walnut, El Segundo, I've been in E1 Segundo
since 1953 and we were one of the first subscribers to the Z channel, or Group
W Cable. We didn't have or have not had a whole lot of trouble, but I do want
to go on record as stating that when we have had, we've been tied up on the
phone for 40 -50 minutes waiting and transferred around to alot of people who
appeared not to really know what they were doing. And I do want to say that
the service men, and I do have their names at home, were really good .... those
that came out. And we don't have a complaint about the service men, because
the service we've had from them has been excellent. It's the administrative
people that we have the problem with, and waiting on the phones.
AIDA WAGNER, 356 Virginia, E1 Segundo, I seem to have the same problem too.
Actually, the newest incident was this morning. Yesterday my cable went out
and through a series of trying to call them, I was not able to get a hold of
them. So I eventually gave up this morning on the Santa Monica office and
called the Hawthorne office - they basically put me on hold for almost 45
minutes and when she came back, I said do you realize that you had me on hold
for 45 minutes, she says we're too busy, what do you want us to do. I said I
don't want you to do anything, I just want to talk to your supervisor and about
that time she put the phone down and I heard the clear sound of I can dial
again. So when I called back, I said what is going on. She says, well, we
don't deal with El Segundo, you better call Santa Monica, we don't even want to
hassle that problem - it's not really our office problem. And eventually when I
got hold of Santa Monica, it was another 35 minute wait of listening to the
latest news on the recording. Found out all about what's going on in the world.
They told me, we know about the problem and they hung up. My basic problem
is to get them so I can tell them what's wrong. They're down right rude, they
seem to be - their main motto seems to be "how can we get rid of our customers ".
Because they do their damnest to (explitive deleted). I do enjoy the services,
they are basically a good cable company, when they are working. And I would like
to have some kind of service like that - but I sure don't want to go through
this same scenario because like a couple of ladies ago, 30 minutes a day takes
from my time and I don't have the time. I also want to mention that about a
year ago I complained about the trees,and I enjoy my trees - they're beautiful
trees.
Council Minutes
June 25, 1985
, i6.5 �
X ti -5 Rh
JIM HOWELL, 439 Lomita, E1 Segundo, other than just basically wanting to
espound upon some of the technical problems that I've experienced with my cable
service, I had it when it was Theta - and now of course, it's Group W. I've
had problems with the ghosting, that I've heard other people complain about,
also what's called herring bone in the picture - it's like little lines that
run through the picture. It seems to me that with the amount of money that
everybody spends in contributing to Group W Cable, that the City of E1 Segundo
could buy their own dish and their big antenna for the local TV stations and
distribute it to the people here in E1 Segundo and use that money that way.
Rather than having to pay Group W and all the problems that we seem to have.
The picture that you get in cable is supposed to be better than what you get
with a TV antenna, but you still have the same problems that you have with an
antenna in this area, due to all the interference. So I'm basically
disappointed with the cable service - a lot of times the channels will
disappear in the middle of a program. They'll switch to another program in
the middle of a program and basically, poor quality.
KATHERINE MILLER, 1242 E. Maple, E1 Segundo, I don't know ..... do you remember
when they were announcing that you could have all the galaxy channels for a
month free? Okay, well, I thought I'd try it to see what's happening. At the
end of the month, I thought, no I don't need all these because basically they
were repetitive. So I said no, at the end of the month I don't want it any
more. It took them 5 months to stop billing me $60.00 a month for the complete
service. And each time it was like 40 minutes - we've got it cleared off Mrs.
Miller, don't worry about it, it's gone. No problem. Next month, here it was
$60.00, $120.00....$240.00, $320.00 .... it took them all that time. And then
they were going to sue me because they kept saying that I owed them all this
money. Finally, I got that all cleared up. Does anybody have the problem of
the color fading in and out? That's a big beef with me. I called them for
service, waited all day Saturday because I work and no one showed up.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: I'm glad you mentioned the color - I thought that was my set.
KATHERINE MILLER: I thought it was too, until I went to a neighbor's house who
has a brand new set. I thought maybe my set's old - it's my set's fault. So I
checked with 2 neighbors, one next door and one a block away. And they're
havinng the same problem with new sets - so it's not my set. It's basically
cable. And I've had it since Theta Cable, too. And I was interested to read
about someone paying $15.00 a month in Hawthorne. I don't know what everyone
else does - but I pay $32.00.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: I should mention Mrs. Miller, and for the rest of your
information, that with recent legislation, the cable company can raise the
rates at their own discretion and without even the courtesy of letting the city
know. So Council no longer has any control over what the rates are.
DAVE JONES, 438 Maryland, E1 Segundo, I'm a subscriber to Theta, and I still
wish I was, because I think about 3 -4 years ago when Group W bought them out is
when all these problemss started. And I remember at the Council meeting, I
don't remember the gentleman who from Group W, promised us the moon and I don't
think we've seen the moon - you people would know that better than I. One
thing I've seen in the last couple of years with Group W is signing up the City
of Torrance, Pasadena, Hawthorne - and where I read where they are giving the
moon to these cities at lower rates, many more channels, I think they supplied
some of the schools with television or whatever. We in E1 Segundo are one of
the first subscribers and I feel like we are an orphan that they have forgotten
us. They have gone out and expanded and got franchises in other cities and
they have not done anything for us here in E1 Segundo. I understand the
equipment is getting quite old, alot of problems are made to us to take care of
this and I don't think it has been done. In closing I would like to recommend
that you people, when the time comes, for this new contract, I think we're on
it til 1990, if we could get out sooner, I wish we could. But take a long hard
look when you go into negotiations because there are other of these services.
Don't let them promise you the moon. Because once you go into that contract
again, until the year of 2100, we're going to buy the same stuff.
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Council Minutes
June 25, 1985
BILL GOODMAN, 613 Arena, E1 Segundo - I've lived in this-hamlet for 63 years.
Frankly, I'm not here to defend Group W but I think the problem dates back to
your predecessors, who signed with Theta for the then state of the art system.
Which was quite adequate at that time. Unfortunately, Group W bought them out
and they are just now adding to the still antiquated system that should have
been torn out completely and redone. All the lines leak - you don't have to be
an electronic engineer to know that electronic lines when they age, leak. And
that's our problem here - we have leaks. It's very discouraging - particularly
I don't think the service is a heck of a lot of difference between Group W and
with Theta. It was bad then and it's bad now today. It's very discouraging
when you're in the middle of a soap opera and they're about to bed down and
it goes dead on you which happened to me yesterday and fortunately, I have two
television sets side by side - one with rabbit ears and one on the cable. And
that's bad scene, you know, when that happens to you. But in general, I would
just have to say the system is antiquated and it should be torn out and started
over again. And not listen to all these good promises that your predecessors
listened to of what all the good things down the road you're going to get. I
don't think we want to pay for it or would want to pay for it if we could have
it. But I think the main problem with Group W - once again to reiterate what
a lot of people have said, is that it's the office personnel, not the people in
the field. They do a fairly good job. One day I called them about having snow
and she what's your problem, I said I had antenna problems - she said what do
you mean by antenna problems. You must know, you read the book. Well, in any
event, she said we'll come out next Tuesday. I said I'm right in the middle of
my soap - I can't wait until next Tuesday. So fortunately I have the other set
there all the time, so it really doesn't make any difference. But I'm still
paying $23 -4 or 5 or whatever,, I don't know. About a month ago, I called and
• man came out and he looked and says working good - I said sure, but it wasn't
• week ago though. So as a courtesy, he climbed the pole and played around a
little bit - about that time my telephone went out. There was a man on a pole
up the street - a block or so away - so I walked up to him, and said any chance
you doing something that coulld be disturbing my telephone service. He said no
but he came down and took a look. He was a lineman, he wasn't a service man
for the house. He climbed the pole and says yeah, somebody pulled your
telephone wire out. I said, oh yeah, there was a cable guy up there about 10
minutes before you.
JERRY WALTERS, 841 1/2 Main, E1 Segundo, I came to add my voice to the den.
I'm no longer a subscriber. My cable blew down off the pole in the fall of '82
in a wind storm - it stayed in my backyard for 3 months. I couldn't get
through on the phone. I wrote letters, I quit paying the bill - they finally
came. I knew they'd come. They took their box and they went. If I knew this
was going to happen tonight, I'd have kept that letter. Maybe I'll still find
it. I agree with the gentleman that says the City can run a better program and
maybe we could get 'ole Gregg here.
RICHARD WALTERS, 324 W. Imperial, #6, E1 Segundo, I'm no longer a subscriber
with Group W. But in the past I've had - I started with Theta Cable. Theta was
bad - that's true, but it was never as near as bad service as what it was with
Group W. You call them up if you have e a problem, you have to wait a week, two
weeks - you have to spend the whole day. I have to work for a living, my wife
works - there's nobody home. The apartment is empty, but if I have to be
there, I tell them I'll be there. They say, well - can't do that. That's
kind of ridiculous for alot of people who have to work. If you set up a time
with them and tell them you'd like them to be there at that particular day for a
time, we'd be there - people would be there. They aren't. Finally, I let mine
go - they disconnected it. I still, right now, am receiving threatening letters
all the time about returning the box. They want me to drive over to Santa
Monica to give them back the box. Where I live , I'm not about to. They
brought it out, I paid a service, they come pick the box up. And anytime
they're willing to come over and discuss it with me, they have my name, they
have my address but some place in Texas keeps sending me threatening letters.
If this could be mutually agreed upon for them to pick up the box,, I'd be glad
to. But it has to be when I'm home.
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Council Minutes
June 25, 1985
X r» R 1
Xii5ps'.
DANA MAJESKI, 318 W. Imperial, #C, El Segundo, in January their guy came out and
asked me if I wanted cable. I signed up for HBO and the movie channel and I
prepaid for the first month plus the installation and I asked them if they'd
call me at work, I said I could be out within 20 minutes and he said that's no
problem. Four days later they came out without calling me ahead of time and
they left me a little note. So I called them back and they said we'll get out
and a few weeks later I receive a bill from them. So I called them up and said
I hadn't been connected yet and I received a bill. They said just ignore the
bill and I waited a few more weeks - I guess it's been 5 weeks total and I
called them up and said I want to cancel. So they tried talking me out of it
but I said no, I want to cancel. And then a few weeks later I received another
bill, so I made a copy of it and wrote a note on the copy and said I'd cancelled
and I don't owe you a cent, you owe me. And this went on for a few weeks more
and I eventually got a call back from the guy that came out in the first place
and he talked to me for a while and I said okay, I'll go with basic cable only
and get it connected up. He said they'd get it connected up on a few weeks.
Still nothing happened - about the end of April I wrote them a letter - I said,
you either hook me up by the 12th of May or I want a refund. Nothing
whatsoever. The end of May I had received a copy of the letter - notice of this
meeting. So I wrote them a letter and included a copy of this notice and last
week I got a call from them - again they tried to get me connected up and I
said, no I just want my money. That's basically my story.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Did you get your money?
DANA MAJESKE - Not yet.
NIGEL AUSTIN WEEKES, 318 Concord, E1 Segundo, I've had so many troubles with
the Group W Cable that I've had since about 14 months ago - that I'm not even
going to list them down. I'll just give you one example. About 5 months ago, I
guess, I forget the exact date, a building was being built behind us on Richmond
Street and somebody somewhere cut the cable. I called Group W and told them
that we were out - the entire building was out. We had some tenants all come
out at the same time and we're sort of looking and trying to figure out what was
going on. And we knew that the whole building was out - we called them up and
they said, well, we can't come out unless we can get into your apartment. I
said, it's not in the apartment it's in the building - they said we can't come
out unless we can get into your apartment because no one else from the building
has called. We have no evidence that the whole building is out - even if you
swear on a Bible that the whole building's out, we can only come if we can get
into your apartment. They eventually said yes, they would come. I waited at
home all day, nobody came. I called them back and they said, well, we'll come
out soon. It was finally about 4 -5 days later they finally came out - and of
course, I wasn't there. They did figure out that the cable was cut and they
fixed it and we finally got it back. It doesn't seem reasonable that they won't
take a subscriber's word for it, especially with all the troubles we've had in
this City. It certainly doesn't seem reasonable that if we take all of them,
that we know where the problem is - they can't come out and fix it without
getting into our apartment. I had an experience before I moved to El Segundo, I
haven't been here that long - just a year and a half. I had an experience in
Playa del Rey with Jack Barry Cable. Paid less money there for more services.
Never had a problem, never had a ghost, never had a bad picture. Always had
excellent service from everybody there. I overpaid them one month - they sent
me a letter back saying they owed me money. That was really nice. I would like
to suggest that the City of El Segundo consider suing Group W for poor service
and converting to Jack Barry, if that's at all possible. Or as the other man
said, put up an antenna on the Hughes building and bring the signal down from
there.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Nigel, let me clarify one thing. You have absolutely no
interest in Jack Barry Cable ?_
NIGEL AUSTIN WEEKES: No, I'm not related to Jack Barry - only difference....I
have nothing to do with them at all. I've had, just as the woman said earlier,
I've had lousy pictures. I consistently on all of the - I only have basic
service - on all of the non -local channels, like WOR, ESPN, CNN - I
-11-
Council Minutes
June 25, 1985
consistently have all the background noise on those channels. It sounds like a
little motor boat running in the background the whole time. It doesn't happen
on the local channels but it's on every single other channel. I can get rid of
that noise if I tuned it so I get rid of the picture. But I can't get both. I
haven't even called them to try to find out, because I just can't afford a
whole day on the phone to talk to these people. I've been hung up on before
now, I've been put on hold and I've hung up on them after half an hour, because
I figured they weren't coming back. Another example is, I watch the arts and
entertainment channel and I've seen them when they switch. They supposedly
switch at 1:00 - I've seen them switch at 1:00 A.M. I've seen them switch 5
minutes early so I loose the last 5minutes of my show. You might be interested
to know that I'm sure they know about this hearing coming up, in the last few
days our service has been on and off all day. This morning at 10:00, I was on
vacation today, that service this morning - I turned it on to see what was
happening, and I got snow - no program. You also might like to know that this
being broadcast right now - I just got home after dinner and I'm watching it on
(taping it as a matter of fact) on the channel it's being broadcast on - the
levels are so low on there, that I had to turn the volume all the way so I
could hear it. I don't know if they don't want us hear what's going on tonight
but it was very, very poor tonight.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: This probably one of the few times I'll defend Group W.
The signal does not originate from the head end or from Group W - that
originates from here in our studio. So if you have sound difficulties or
technical difficulties, that could be our own system on that.
JULIE McADAMS, 601 W. Grand, E1 Segundo, I had forgotten forgot about this
meeting, so I came by real quick. I called in Group W June 1st to arrange for
June 8th and they never showed up. I called about 4:00 P.M. and I got man on
the phone who said I know about your problem and hung up on me. Well, when I
called on Monday, I got this guy who was just so nice, saying none of our
installers showed up - and he was in a really bad mood - this guy was nice but
he hung uup on you because he was in a bad mood. So I arranged for the
following Saturday which was the Saturday that just past - but I had to leave.
So I called on Thursday to cancel because I wanted to wait until after this
meeting before. Because all I wanted was the Disney channel for my two children
and last night at 9:00 P.M. I got a call from the same nice guy - who said if
-they had a special deal for a day - that if I cancelled my order, which would
be $90 - $20 deposit for Disney, $13.95 for the Disney, $9.50 for my channel box
with another $20 installation and then the $27 fee - it came to $95. That if I
cancelled that - he woulld drop all installation and all I'd have to do is pay
for the box on Disney and a $27 installation fee - which brought it down to
about $50. And I told him that I really couldn't do it - I needed to save my
money. And he said oh come on, and I said - I'm a single parent and I need to
save my money. He said, well I've got a house and a new car that I have to pay
for - and I said well, I think I'll have to wait a while. And he said, well
this is only going to be good for a day or two. And I said I think I'll wait
because I did want to hear what was going to happen tonight.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: How much were they going to charge you for the Disney
channel?
JULIE McADAMS: $13.95.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: You mentioned something about a $90.
JULIE McADMAS: It was going to be $9.50 for the box, $20 installation for the
box, $13.95 for Disney, $20 for the Disney box, $27.50 for the installation and
if I ordered last night, I would have gotten it for minus $40.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: Nick, I might mention this. I had no idea what
the normal charges are - it might be good for Council to have these documented.
It almost sounds like it's duplicating charges.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: There's also the possibility there's an enthusiatic
marketing person who gets carried away.
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Council Minutes
June 25, 1985
X c»83
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CITY MANAGER ROMANIELLO: I think that's exactly what she had. A salesman who
wasn't giving her the accurate story. Because I've never heard of fees in
those ranges.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: They seemed high to me.
LESLIE MILLER, 627 Eucalyptus, E1 Segundo, I would point out first of all that
about three years ago when I was in Westchester, I had Jack Barry Cable and
was much higher quality. I also have no relation to Jack Barry Cable or no
interest in it. It was cheaper, it had more stations and the picture quality
was fantastic. The Group W Cable does not have a good quality picture, even
channel 7 will have the herring bone in it quite frequently. The people at the
offices are rude, as everyone else has said. We moved from Main Streeet to our
present home on Eucalyptus about a year and half ago and we had problems with
double billing. We moved the box with us which was at their suggestion and
they tried to tell us we owed them the deposit for the box on the Main Street
address. And we went through - I went through about 10 calls with the usual
half hour delays, on hold, and finally, and I might suggest to everyone else if
they have this problem - I wrote to the President of Group W Cable and
unfortunately I tried to find the letter - I don't have his address. The
letter went out and within 2 days I got a telephone call from a lady - not at
the Santa Monica office. And she was very, very eager to solve all my
problems. And they did straightened out after that. One other
complaint that I have - is something I'm sure most people haven't heard about,
but I just found about it today - as many of you know, stereo TV has finally
come into reality in this country. The FCC has set up a standard broadcasting
in stereo. Well, it seems that the people at Group W in their wisdom, are not
going to be broadcasting in stereo on Group W with their system. What this
means is, if you buy stereo TV - you go out and spend your hard earned money
and buy a stereo, capable television set, you will not get all the programming
on Group W in stereo. They are going to charge $100 (aproximately) - I'm sure
the price will go up before we actually see it - for an extra piece of hardware
which will be placed in your home and which will allow you to receive stereo on
Group W. I think this is ridiculous and I don't think there's any need for it.
ENRIQUE ORTIZ, 1736 E. Sycamore, E1 Segundo, I'd like to say that it's great to
see all these Group W subscribers laughing at the problems but I also notice
our rep over there laughing too. And I just don't think it's a very funny
problem. It's not funny at all when you work hard for your money and you're
paying for service and you get lousy reception, poor service - it's funny,
isn't it. And I just think it's close to thievery. And it's not funny when
you're sitting on the phone.....
CITY MANAGER ROMANIELLO: Mr. Otiz, I'm not a representative of Group W. I
represent....
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: That's Mr. Romaniello, our City Manager - he's on our side.
ENRIQUE ORTIZ: Well, where's the Group rep, I thought....
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: He'll be stepping up pretty soon, I'm sure.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: The ones getting lower in the seats.
ENRIQUE ORTIZ: Excuse me, I apologize. I think it's close to thievery, I
really do. And not only stealing your money by the lousy service, but you're
sitting there paying your damn phone bill .... excuse me. For an hour you're
sitting there ..... I've been switched around from operator to operator, call
this number, call that number and I think it's a bunch of baloney - I don't
mean to use harsh words but ... I'd like to tell them what I think about their
service.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: I think that's obvious.... thank you Enrique.
CITY MANAGER ROMANIELLO: I have a used car for sale, if you're interested.
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Council Minutes
June 25, 1985
CHARLES O'HERN, 912 Virginia, E1 Segundo, First of all I'd like to back up Mark
Jones' statement about Pacific Sands he made earlier. My son lived there a few
years while he was going to college and he had nothing but complaints for what
was going on there. But second, I've lived in many different places, including
Belgium where we had cable service, Ohio (Wilmington, Ohio), Hillsboro,
Indiana. We got cable service from Cincinnati, E1 Paseo, Texas, White Sands,
New Mexico. First of all someone here made the statement in the local paper -
this system, Group W is the worst in the country. Well, I'll agree it's second
worst in the country. White Sands was the worst. But it was free.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: I'll restate my statement. For the money, Group W is the
worst in the country.
CHARLES O'HERN: One of the problems Group W really shows is a perfect example
of a system which has been installed and over the period of time since it was
installed, all that's been accomplished is people have been hooked on,
disconnected and really no preventive maintenance has been done. Probably
every coax cable out there, every connection is corroded, every .... or leaks as
the man says, because everytime you have corrosion it occurs. We're on the
seashore and with the salt water, the air, this is going to occur. But that
means that the cable service with the price they charges, should be doing
something about some sort of service action. The electric utilities take care
of their power lines, telephone company takes care of their telephone lines and
the cable company should do things other than just spot services, when somebody
complains, yeah, they come out and fix it but that doesn't really solve the
problem. And the second biggest problem they've got is in their distribution
service from wherever the central antenna is for their satellite. Satellites -
the signals received from the satellites is weaker than the signals that come
from the local channels. We see that indicated in the cable distribution when
we're observing the picture. If you look over in Hawthorne, and you look at El
Segundo, you'll the difference in the quality of service. And I don't want to
take up anymore of your time but I'm sure some other people want to talk so I
just wanted to get those comments in.
KEITH SHERMAN, 624 1/2 W. Mariposa, E1 Segundo, about two weeks or two months
ago, I had a problem with my cable and it took attempts to fix it. And on the
second attempt to call, I asked them to suspend the bill until the service was
fixed and they said they couldn't. I asked them to go back to the very
beginning and they said they couldn't do that. I guess I'd like to see them
have automatic deal, so that when you have problems with your cable to just
suspend the bill until the service is working again. And then you could have
your bill start again. Also, I'd like to complain about the commercials -
whenever the commercials come on the cable channels - really loud. Really dump
at you.
DON ROWLAND, 609 E. Pine, E1 Segundo, I'm one of twelve owners in two new
townhomes on the corner of East Pine and Sierra. I've gotten as far as these
other ladies and gentlemen. Shortly after we moved in, there was a saleman at
the door and I wanted to sign up for cable but I was told unless everyone in
all the units signed up, then none of us could have cable TV. The line's
already there and is already to hook up to and I thought it rather strange
being that I lived up on Maple Ave. for ten years and didn't have the same
problem up there - anyone that wanted the cable could hook up to it.
TERESA PEDIACT, 1645 E. Maple, E1 Segundo, and I did submit a letter to Jack -
it was an example to site, just what I had to go through for one call. It took
two weeks to get in touch with Group W. That just goes to show you the numbers
- if I had to site everytime I called I think I'd have a long list from here to
there. My biggest complaint is trying to get through to Group W. It used be
from 7:00 - 9:00 at night and now it's 7:00 - 7:00 and sometimes if you work
until 6:00 it's very difficult to get .... if you have shopping chores or
whatever, it's difficult to get in touch with Group W. I do want to
compliment - at the same time I'm complaining, the service person that came
out. He did a very good job.
RAMON BORONDA, 221 Arena, E1 Segundo, I thought I was the only one that had
these kind of problems, I know - I feel better.
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Council Minutes
June 25, 1985
Xt>>IR;
X 65IR6
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: You feel worse, not better.
RAMON BORONDA: Misery loves company. My problems start back over eight years
ago, when my wife and I first took the cable service. I won't go back far
- I'll go back as far as December of 183 when it was out for a week of service.
I called, and I think her name was Deidre, the customer rep, who promised me a
credit for a week out of service. I just received the credit last month. I
shorted my each month billing by $4.00 which I think aided the company, because
I eventually took a credit for only $4.00 for a week's worth of service and I
charged at that time about $24.00 for the month. I kept on receiving these
lovely notices - and I don't know if any of you received these notices - if
you're a little tiny late over their due date on their bills, my bill says due
upon receipt. Well, I'm on a budget and I pay my bills at certain times of the
month. And Group W because they're so close to my heart, I tend to push it back
a little bit. And I love getting my next bill that says down at the bottom, we
will turn your account over to a collection agency if you don't pay right away.
Well, I've got a word for that too. I'll not use it here because I don't want
to be stricken from the record. I don't need that kind of nonsense when it's
crummy service. I think we're dealt with in a very - how can I put it
delicately. I just think we're dealt with very poorly from a customer service
point of view. Of all the people I've dealt with, only one - by the name of
Michael - has been helpful. And I've dealt with probably six customer reps over
the years. I doubt he's still there. A man of good taste won't stick around
there. Needless to say, I'm very displeased with their service. We had a man
come out in - I believe - December of 184, a service man. He was very nice - he
worked at the gizzmo at the pole because we were getting very fuzzy service and
his parting shot to me as he went - a very polite man - was that you know you
should call and complain to Group W the management people, because they know
that their service is obsolete, that their equipment in E1 Segundo is obsolete,
and only by complaining or listing your grievances with them, will they ever
upgrade their antiquated service. Well, I hope tonight is a positive step in
that direction. That's all I'll say, but they need help.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Is there anyone else cares to address that Council that has
any other complaints, complaints other than what have already been voiced. I
think it's been pretty well covered. Ron, you asked to make sure that everyone
had their name and address down for poor service or whatever little complaint,
did you not? And there was a....
CITY MANAGER ROMANIELLO: We circulated a clipboard with ....hopefully you've
all signed up - with your name, address and if you're going to send us any
copies of your receipts or bills or anything, if you send me a copy, I'll keep
it or if you send me your original, I'll Xerox it and return a copy to you.
But in any case, whatever information you'd like to get to the City, send it in
as quickly as possible. I'd appreciate that.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Bill, what important gem did you forget?
BILL GOODMAN, 613 Arena, E1 Segundo, It's not going to be repetitious. I'd just
like to make an observation that the signal we get from Santa Monica is not
monitored. The only way they know if we have problems here is if someone calls
in. So I certainly think we'd have a system that would be monitored in E1
Segundo, not in Santa Monica. Or if for instance, they move to Hawthorne,
monitored in Hawthorne. Let's have it monitored in E1 Segundo.
COUNCILMAN SCHULDT: Bill,can you imagine watching your soaps in stereo?
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: For another $100. Let's .... I have to offer something in
defense of Group W Cable TV. And I'm not being solicitous or anything else,
but I want you to know I was quite impressed from last Saturday. I work - as
alot of you know - I work a lot of track meets, and I officiated at a corporate
relay track meet down at Cal State Long Beach last week and I want you to know
that on the track, Group W Cable TV won several events. Now that's a hell of a
long way from our TV sets, but they did win a few events.
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June 25, 1985
If there's no one else .... I see a hand, please.
LILLIAN COMPTON, 913 McCarthy Court, E1 Segundo, I'll just ditto everything
that went before, and the thing I'm interested in, is that we find out why
there's no consistency in fees charged to customers. Not only in E1 Segundo,
but from between E1 Segundo and other areas. I know for a fact that Group W
doesn't charge the same fees to other cities - customers in other cities. Now
did I understand Jack that we (as a City) have no control over the fees charged
or just raising them?
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: No, over the fees period. It used to be where you'd have
to get the cities ..... in fact, our agreement with Group W, which is a carry
over from Theta and Teleprompt states that we would have approval. That was
lost once, about two yeas, with the passage of SB 66, the power of your city
over what Group W can and cannot do, should or should not do, has been
weakened considerably. I think there are alternative ways to address the
problem and I'm anxious to hear what Group W has to say tonight.
LILLIAN COMPTON: I was just curious about the fee.
DAVE SIEMENSKI, 945 Sheldon, E1 Segundo, I have just one question of Group W,
if they have representatives here. I wanted to know if it would be possible to
WGN, the Chicago station. There's some convaluted explanation of why they
can't. There's only three super stations, WTBS, WOR, and WGN. For some reason,
some cable systems WGN and WTBS and we get WTBS and WOR. I'd like to know why
we can't get WGN, also. I liked some Group W rep to address that, if they
could. And the Nashville network - let's get it all.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Sir, are you just standing against the wall or ..... no, that's
alright. Okay, I'm going to close the public hearing.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: Before you do, maybe I could register a complaint for
someone who wasn't able to attend tonight. Maybe it would be appropriate to
put it in at this time.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: In a letter - was it on the sheet that we got?
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: He wanted me to relay the information he gave me
regarding his problems.
CITY MANAGER ROMANIELLO: You could pass it on to me. We have a lot of
letters, we didn't bother reading them all into the record. But we will make
copies and give them all to Group W.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: This gentleman hasn't written anything down - he just
told me his problems and I thought maybe they should go on the record. It's
just that he asked me to bring it up and he works tonight and won't be able to
be here. And his particular problem was the ghosting that the cable has and his
ghosting will last a week and then will be out a week - will be on a week and
then off a week. And he has numerous times - he's always complained about being
unable to get through to the service department - but the numerous times he
complains, when they come out and work on it, his ghosting goes away but hee
insists that the people around the block, their ghosting starts at that time.
And then when they complain for a week or two later, their ghosting will be
improved and he will have it back again. Now, whether that's true or if the
ghosting just happens to come or go - I don't know. But he wishes to have that
looked into.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: I'd like to close the public hearing at this particular time.
Perhaps come back to it.
RONALD ELLIS, 1620 E. Maple, E1 Segundo, You guys have cable at home. What is
your complaint.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Yes, - same as yours.
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RONALD ELLIS: I don't have one yet. And anybody that looks at TV all day long
shouldn't be complaining. Now, I concur that there is a problem. Because we
were the first people in E1 Segundo when Hughes started the program. Which Mr.
Siadek said. You guys have never been paid yet, have you?
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Paid for what?
RONALD ELLIS: The money they're supposed to pay you.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: The City.
RONALD ELLIS: Right. What is that Jack?
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: There's some problem with the collection of some of the
fees.
RONALD ELLIS: Okay, let's hear about it.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: That's in litigation.
CITY MANAGER ROMANIELLO: That's not an appropriate item.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: What we're discussing is television.
RONALD ELLIS: Where I live it's marvelous.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Where do you live?
RONALD ELLIS: 1620 E. Maple.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: You don't have it.
RONALD ELLIS: Of course, I have cable. Why am I here?
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Well, it's nice to hear one....
RONALD ELLIS: I think it's marvelous. To different areas, it is bad. And all
these people that have been complaining, the majority of them are from out
state. They don't have cable where they came from - probably work at Hughes...
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Mr. Ellis, I think.....
RONALD ELLIS: It's rather disgusting the way this meeting is going on.
Nobody paid me.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Mr. Ellis, this meeting is set up for one thing and that's to
hear the inadequacies of Group W service in E1 Segundo. If you have a kind
word to say - which I think you just did, because your service is excellent
then that's fine.
RONALD ELLIS: Can we have a meeting in about a month on the traffic problem
here in town.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: We've had—you hit a sore spot. We've had numerous ones
that you have not bothered to attend.
RONALD ELLIS: I've been out of town. Now send us a document and let us
know...
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Are you living in another state now, Mr. Ellis? Thank you.
I will accept one more comment.
DENNIS CUSHNER: Are you going to discuss the reason why?
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: No, not to my knowledge. We have a representative, I believe
- several, one or two from Group W Cable TV and will you identify yourself.
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June 25, 1985
CITY MANAGER ROMANIELLO: I think that the Group W people that are here - are
here to observe. They're not here to....
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Let me ask this. Do they have anything ... we will not berage
you with a whole -a shotgun or anything like that, but if you....you have heard
an adequate cross - section of complaints and I think they're quite legitimate
and - I turn on my TV to watch the news and maybe something to fall to sleep by
perhaps, but I rarely turn it on. I don't have any particular complaints
except the picture's lousy. But besides that, excuse me ..... if you have
something to address.
BILL ROSENDAHL, Director of Corporate Affairs, Group W, New York is listening
and I will report this back to New York tomorrow morning. They will know of
your concerns, they will know of your complaints. With me tonight is the
management team in our Santa Monica system. I would just like the Group W
employees, at this point, just to stand so that the people can see who they
are.
CITY MANAGER ROMANIELLO: And duck.
BILL ROSENDAHL: All of these representatives will be available after the
meeting to deal with any particular customer /your constituents complaints. We
have all been taking copious notes - I wrote down 33 individuals - I think
that's a right number. I might be off by 1 or 2, that had a concern and we were
dovetailing with that - we passed a list around where we want your name and
address. We will follow up on every complaint that was directed at us tonight.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Bill, may I interject just one thing. This is a scratch of
the surface of the people here. There are others.
BILL ROSENDAHL: Mr. Mayor, we will start with the people in the room and we
will be very happy to look at every complaint that you have on file and we
certainly welcome you to appeal to your constituents of anyone else who has any
further complaints and we'll be happy to take those complaints. And I will
pledge tonight that every complaint we heard tonight, will be resolved in the
near future. We will be delighted to come back to the Council and give you a
report on each one of these complaints.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: Let's tighten that up a little bit. You'll come back to
the Council.
BILL ROSENDAHL: Yes we will.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: Your general manager is supposed to appear before the
Council on a regular basis - once a quarter. He's been here once in the two
yeas you've had the system. One time to come in and report to the Council and
to the people on what's happening with the system, what's the penetration
rates. Mr. Rosendahl, I've met with you three times now, and these promises
sound very good - and you're a very articulate person and I've had it with the
promises.
BILL ROSENDAHL: Mr. Councilman, I totally agree with you and I would like -
and I was about to say, that I want to introduce to you, the general manager of
our Santa Monica system that is responsible for E1 Segundo - Mr. Don Phillips
who is standing here in the audience with me. Mr. Phillips will be here on a
quarterly basis to attend your meetings and we will take all of these
complaints that we got tonight and we will investigate each and every one of
them and report them back to the Council. I agree that there are problems in
El Segundo. The solution I.see is the following: better management - I think
that was an underlying theme by many of you tonight. Well, I'm proud to say
that Don Phillips came on board about two months ago, had 18 years of
experience in the industry and I've had the pleasure in the last couple of
months of watching him go after the entire operation that he's responsible for
and deal with customer service issues and has begun to dramatically turn around
some of these problems that you are talking about tonight. Better customer
service - no excuse, for any of the complaints that you made tonight. That's a
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June 25, 1985
)( ;5191)
direct indication in my opinion of not giving our customer service people either
the support or having the right customer service people. And we are doing
things on both fronts. We have put an incentive program together internally for
our people to upgrade them and to support them - including an institute, a
training institute that just opened in the last three months where we take our
customer service people and put them through a course of how to deal with the
public. You have not felt that here and if you haven't - I apologize to that.
But you will sense a better customer response in the very near future. In the
very near future. The next issue is better signal quality. I have met with a
member of your city staff who is no longer here - and we at Group W Cable are
willing to pick up the tab to the tune of $3,000.00 for an independent analysis
of the signal to find out what the problems are with the signal and of the
system. And with that make in mind, maintenance and preventive maintenance is
what's planned to be done with it. That's about .... talk is cheap, actions speak
louder than words. And I can tell you that tonight's complaints will be acted
upon and any future complaints.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: Mr. Rosendahl, you talk about in the near future. What
is...give us a time frame. When are you going to resolve these problems? You
counted 33 - I counted 120 people here tonight. Alot of folks did not give up
and speak their....didn't talk about their problems, they probably have signed
the sheet. What is the time frame?
BILL ROSENDAHL: Well, a reasonable time frame should be - first of all this
shouldn't exist. So let's say that - could you give us 30 days on all of this?
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: Now, you're making a commitment, with all due respect.
You're from Corporate Affairs and you're the guy that sells the franchises to
people like us. Well, that's what part of your responsibilities are and you're
now telling us and telling these folks that you're going to take care of their
problems in 30 days. The man who's responsible for this is sitting back there.
Mr. Phillips, do you think 30 days is fair?
DON PHILLIPS, General Manager, Santa Monica Group W Office, I think Bill is
trying to be very fair in trying to deal with the problems that we have here
this evening of 32 -35 complaints. And yes, I think we can handle those in the
30 day period. If in fact, this is only a sampling of those people who will be
calling in, I think we would be remiss to say that we're going to it in 30
days. I think we'll be able to give a report back to you and to these people
and I would hope if we're able to satisfy their concerns, they will give you a
positive report back. But I'm interested in telling you that whatever else we
do undercover, I would look to a 60 - no longer than 90 days on the technical
problems that we want to look into. It's very difficult for me to - when
you're talking about ghosting, about leakage - you're talking about a number of
problems that we will have to address to look into. I have a pretty good
preventive maintenance team but we will address the problems, identify them and
correct them. What I think I'd like to look at a 60 day period, Jack - and
with what we've got tonight and then if something else comes in on top of that,
as those come in, we'll try to look at a 90 day on the outside. And that's
something we can live with and I think that's something these people would
accept.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: Mr. Phillips do you have a phone number - besides the
regular phone number that we might be able to reach you?
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: I think everyone should know that when I gave out Mike
Kemph's phone number at a public meeting, the number was changed. So if you
plan on giving the number.....
MR. PHILLIPS: Well, what I'm goiug to do, is give you this number this
evening, I want to advise you on a couple of things that we have accomplished.
Please take this down - (213)828 -5894. But remember I can take .... we've just
recently moved our facilities from where they've been for a good many years -
we've put in a new telephone system as of ..... and I hear all of these
complaints and they're very appropriate. We've experienced some real
difficulty in the two months I've been here - that's why I took the liberty to
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Council Minutes
June 25, 1985
get involved quickly and we made the move to the new facility, we have a new
system now that I feel the bugs are pretty much worked out. But like anything
new, there's days when GTE's trunks die, we've got 2 or 3 that go bad - they'll
turn around and come out and repair them. We expect that and you do too. But
for the most part, you're going to see an improved communications system. As
far as the billing system, we've also just made a recent change and a conversion
and I think somebody mentioned that they noticed the difference in the new bill.
Well, we're working out those gliches in the conversion and I think you're
going to see the billing problems as well as the computer problems that one lady
mentioned - she said she had computers and they didn't fail all the time. And
ours won't either. After the conversions over, I think you're going to find
that when you call in - we're able now to look into the billing system and find
out if you did pay the bill and the date you paid it and give you credit. And
for the past sins, I really can't address. I'm not aware of them - I am
appreciative of the time you took this evening to come from your homes and share
with us the problems that you experienced and some of them....
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: Mr. Phillips, if you don't mind, these folks have come here
tonight with a problem and I think that perhaps they should have a priority on
the....you have marketing blitzes to go out and sell a program, why don't we
have a service blitz on E1 Segundo.
DON PHILLIPS: I thinks that's what we're going to do. That's what you asked
for.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: That's excellent.
DON PHILLIPS: That's why I said the 30 days - 60 day periods. But I'm not
going to look at a situation where I make a commitment to you and then you
come back to me and say you didn't do it. I'd try to look at the commitment as
one that's real. And I think where we're at with these problems, within a 30
day period - some of these problems by the way, out of the 30 -35, some of them
have been resolved, but it was just unhappiness. There was rudeness, there was
customer relations, there was customer service problems. We will make a
management evaluation and try to look into the situation. Some of them I think
that have been resolved, we appreciate your patience. Those that haven't been
resolved, we'll give you some action.
COUNCILMAN SCHULDT: There's two things. How are we going to keep this
problem, of you know, calling up and not getting any answer. That's something
that has to be worse than having the problem. That's taking 3 -4 hours to....
DON PHILLIPS: Shouldn't happen. That's .... I totally agree with you and that's
why I explaind to you that we had just put in the new telephone system. We
have three lines coming in from what we call foreign exchange lines - coming in
from E1 Segundo, so you can call in free. Those are tied to the trunks and
I ... the problems we've had with the move, has caused a large number of billing
errors when the computer....on the conversion, we had some problems and it has
tied up the telephone lines. I can't do anything about that, if .... I can tell
you that what we're working toward and the engineering /telecommunication
engineering we've received from the telephone companies, tell us we have
adequate service to handle our problems. And if it proves that it isn't
adequate, of course, we'll expand it.
COUNCILMAN SCHULDT: As long as I've h
fortunately I don't have any problems,
for the last three years, but over the
thing .... seems like they have 3 people
answering to take your order. So that
that's not new to the system.
ad cable, at different times I've called,
and I haven't had where I live right now
years, you know, you call and the same
answering for problems and 90 people
don't make any ..... so it's something
DON PHILLIPS: I didn't say it was ... I just was explaining to you what we've
done as recently as three weeks ago, June 3rd when we moved into the new
facility. And I really can't .... I hear you and I hear what you're telling me
what's happened through the years, but I'm also sharing with you that...I guess
I'm even asking you to understand that we have made improvements, that Group W
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has been listening - they've taken the opportunity to expand the facility,
we're hiring people to accommodate these same type of customer relations
problems and I think now what we have to ask for is - give us the 30 days, give
us the patience and see what, if in fact, this time around it isn't better.
COUNCILMAN SCHULDT: How come these people make appointments and then they
don't get met? I'm sure it works both ways - people make appointments and
they're not there either.
DON PHILLIPS: I believe each one of them that made statements tonight that
they did have problems. And those commitments should be met - it seems strange
to me that people would come out on the 19th when they made the appointment on
the 20th. What went through my mind at that particular time, just as an
example. Man may have been in the area for something else and came by - he was
doing another installation or service call and thought he might be doing
somebody a favor by being there early. And went ahead and stopped by, but the
fact that he didn't come back the following day doesn't really support that.
But I tried to be a good listener, give us an opportunity to evaluate what we
have heard and then give us an opportunity to come back in 30 days and report
to Council.
COUNCILMAN SCHULDT: I'm sure if you don't hear, we will.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Mr. Phillips, before you leave I have a calendar..... excuse
me, let me ask you a question. As....I noticed with Keith and also with Le and
now just with me, when I spoke - is there a sound problem.
DON PHILLIPS: I thought you were coming from back there (in the back of the
room).
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: Everyone's looked behind them when somebody speaks.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: I was curious. Because if that's going to happen, then
something's...Group W doesn't have anything to do with this does it? Excuse
me, that was a rotten thing to say.
CITY MANAGER ROMANIELLO: Mr. Mayor, because of the crowd we have the foyer
speakers on and that.....
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: I'm looking at my calendar and as today is the 25th, we have
a Council meeting on the 16th, if we gave until .... could you make a report on
the 6th of August. Nick, could we get that on the agenda perhaps. That's 5 -6
weeks. That gives you more than adequate timing.
DON PHILLIPS: We could even give you some type of call or meet with Nick ahead
of that time. But as far as coming to the Council, I think we should follow
along with this - we won't be working on all the problems all in the same day -
so we could even give you some type of a weekly or biweekly progress report.
It's fine, we're interested in having every subscriber we can have. We're in
business to serve cable subscribers and although Group W has had some
difficulty in some of the investments they've made in the cable plant and I
think ... not to hit the subject hard, but I think Group W is interested in going
forward and giving and improving the cable plan and enhancing the cable plan
and that's why they have addressed the Council on getting an extension to make
that investment worthwhile. So it isn't a short term investment and we can go
forward with giving these people some of the things they ask for.
I think that's in another subject, I don't want to get off on it. We have by
that intent and that effort, we're interested in doing something with E1
Segundo. August 6th is fine, Nick. If that's alright with you.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: I think that gives our City Attorney an opportunity by
August 6 to evaluate the lease agreement, the franchise agreement. And let's
take a look at that and see what can be done.
CITY ATTORNEY DOLLEY: We're doing that.
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June 25, 1985
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: I have one gentlemen in the rear who has a desperate
question.
WILLIE KLINGER, 417 E. Oak, E1 Segundo, do you have parking at the new location
in Santa Monica?
DON PHILLIPS: We moved to a new location in Santa Monica - and that was one of
the items we're concerned with. I have 15 visitors parking places - a good
lobby for you come into and we appreciate your being interested in dropping it
off. Have good parking.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Would those Group W people please stand up again so that
everyone can identify them. And those people will be where Mr. Phillips?
DON PHILLIPS: We'll just line up or meet us in the lobby - wherever.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: I closed the public hearing. Could we close the microphone.
We can't do that?
RONALD ELLIS: In Palm Springs, when the TV went off and they loved it. Let's
do it with these people.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: There's a couple of comments from Council.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: This is a regular Council meeting we are holding and
there is one small item of business that I would like to bring up before we
adjourn. But it's not on this subject.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: As far as I'm concerned, this subject is over unless the rest
of Council has anything to discuss at this particular moment. Nick, you have
your direction on it. Mrs. Synadinos.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: The item - Mr. Hart did discuss with me a week ago
about something maybe the City of E1 Segundo could do for the captives in
Beirut. And we just lightly discussed it and I noticed the City of Manhattan
Beach is putting out the yellow ribbons and the yellow bows.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: On your way out, please be extremely quiet.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: As a gesture for the captives - I know it's been done
before in this country for the POW's and it was also done for the people in
Iran and I would like Council just to discuss, possibly at the next Council
meeting - we could possibly pass a ordinance in support of this....
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: Show as much politeness as you expect from Group W Cable.
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: I would like Council to give it some thought and see
if there is some type of gesture or some other item that we might do to show
our support for captured American citizens in foreign countries. The yellow
bow is one suggestion, the lowering of the American flag, displaying the flag
24 hours a day illuminated - is one of Mr. Hart's suggestions. But would
Council give it some thought. And maybe come back at the next meeting - I
would like to join the rest of the United States in showing our disgust and our
hope for our captives.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: I have no disagreement with that.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: Can I give it some thought?
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: Yes, that's what I meant. Just give it some thought
and may be give bring it to the next Council meeting.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: This is a continuation of an adjourned Council meeting held
at 4:00 P.M. and will we adjourn this one, Mr. Dolley,...is this one to be
adjourned -
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MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: We need a date for a public hearing....
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: We need a date for a public hearing.
CITY MANAGER ROMANIELLO: We can either adjourn this and then....in which case
our next meeting will be the next regularlly scheduled Council meeting or we
can adjourn this to a date sooner for the public hearing of the adoption of
the fiscal budget.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: I think it's more in line to adjourn it to next Tuesday,
which is July 2nd? July 2nd already. Adjourn it to that date, Mr. Hart,
because we certainly not going to.....
CITY CLERK HART: Mr. Mayor, could you just adjourn it?
MAYOR PRO TEM SYNADINOS: We need to set up a date for the public hearing for
the budget, is that correct at this time?
CITY MANAGER ROMANIELLO: If you want to establish it at this time, then it
would be a good idea, then we can give the notices out. But you don't have to
adjourn this meeting to that date unless you want to set it right at this time.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: No, we'll just adjourn it.
COUNCILMAN SIADEK: Before we adjourn it .... I would, I would .... I've been
involved in this cable thing for a long time and you folks, you may have never
been to a Council meeting and we all appreciate very much you're coming down
and spending the time with us and letting yourself be heard and those who
hadn't had a chance to be heard, writing it down. It's a real part of what
your government's all about. And thank you very much.
MAYOR ARMSTRONG: We're all appreciative. Meeting's adjourned.
ADJOURNMENT: No other business appearing to come before Council at this
meeting, the meeting was adjourned at 8:10 P.M.
Su ed,
onald L. Hart
City Clerk
APPROVED:
Charles K. r rong, a
-23-
Council Minutes
June 25, 1985